The Future Is Bright w/ Michael Saylor & Cathie Wood - Bitcoin Conference

introduce rather the next panel

I want to share with you guys an

anecdote

over the past two years I've been

attempting to orange pill people in my

life as I'm sure many of you have as

well

and my father and mother have been one

of those and I've been particularly

effective with my dad who incidentally I

brought here with me to this conference

and it's amazing to see him witness all

of this

and side note if you are orange pilling

family members just be careful right

because you might be sitting around a

family dinner sometime and someone

brings up like a critique of Bitcoin and

if you've done too good of a job but

you're the family member that you orange

pill might like jump down their throat

if they're not calling out Fiat as a

scam so just take it easy and be careful

you don't create too many monsters in

your family

but the reason why I bring him up is

because I brought him to an event last

night

and after we were there meeting tons of

great people learning a ton all that

kind of stuff he remarked to me man

everybody's so positive everybody's so

happy everybody's so humble everyone's

so polite everyone's so smart

and I was like yeah that's that's

Bitcoin that's what this is all about

people are engaged and motivated

enthusiastic for the future we have in

store now that we have a tool like

Bitcoin

and so this next panel is going to be

discussing the bright orange future that

is Bitcoin so please help me welcome to

the stage Kathy Wood the founder CEO CIO

of Arc invest

[Music]

and Michael Saylor the Giga chat himself

CEO of microstrategy

[Applause]

well Cassie

um

I just wanted to dispel one question

I've been getting

all morning as I walk around the show

people are asking me whether or not I'm

still bullish on bitcoin

and I would like to you know just

clarify that I am more bullish than ever

on bitcoin

the future is bright so um our you know

we're here to talk about what we see in

the future

and uh

you've spent a career in institutional

investment in capital markets looking at

it from the point of view of an investor

and and I spent my career attempting to

attract money from people like you

uh running a company in the in the

public market and so I think we're both

uh half of the coin

and that's why I was exciting to talk

with you today so

in my mind I got I got three main areas

the political macroeconomic regulatory

environment

what's going on there in the next year

to two years

and the second is is um

the uh the capital markets and what's

going on with uh large pools of money

the people running the trillions and

trillions of dollars I guess hundreds of

trillions of dollars and then the third

is technology and of course you love

technology

you know the capital markets

we both have political opinions yes okay

so why don't we start with uh politics

and Regulation and economics what do you

see as we look forward and how you think

it's going to affect Bitcoin

well I I think the most interesting

thing that's happened and we met someone

from Mississippi

I think a congressman from Mississippi

and I'm seeing the politics around

Bitcoin changing radically because it

has become you know uh the the single

issue that some people are voting on and

this is bipartisan uh and even where

we've moved in Saint Pete uh because

people know that uh I'm very Bitcoin uh

focused uh they the politicians have

become come to me and said I want to I

want to

pulled together a room of Bitcoin

enthusiasts and I I really want to learn

from them what they want from us think

about that think about that that's that

is a radical shift over the last few

years the other thing that I see so a

year ago roughly when Janet Yellen was

appointed treasury secretary I remember

her first comments about Bitcoin where

money laundering you know nefarious

characters

environmentally damaging and then two

weeks ago someone's whispering in her

ear and we talked about this you think

it might be Gary Gensler there is

someone whispering in uh the the ears of

politicians if you want to lose if you

want the U.S to lose out on this the one

of the most amazing Innovation platforms

of all times you keep talking like that

so she has changed her tune so I'm very

positive here and of course we're

meeting people from around the world

just met from Honduras Mexico I think

the movement is spreading pretty quickly

now yeah I think the last 12 months has

been just 180 degree turn

if you roll back 12 months you you had

so many smart people that had a lot of

money and power saying Bitcoin looked

too good to be true it's so good

someone's going to ban it right we heard

that and I think a couple of weeks ago

with the with the executive order what

we had was the president of the United

States

giving a green light

to bitcoin

you have a one-page memo and it says

whereas 40 million Americans you know

rely upon this and this is part of their

future I hereby direct every government

agency to get educated on bitcoin and

figure out how you incorporated into the

government and I think that if I scan

the last hundred years of history and I

asked when's the last time the president

of the United States directed the

government to embrace a new asset class

the answer is never

so I think that Bitcoin should be taking

a Victory lap for what happened here

just in the past few weeks in the United

States government because a year ago

Bitcoin was maybe it was Eastern

technology and it wasn't Western

technology and maybe the government was

going to ban it and we're afraid of it

and what happened the last 12 months is

Bitcoin moved West Bitcoin has been

embraced the Administration has given a

green light to bitcoin

and you know Congress and the Senate are

enthusiastically figuring out

Bitcoin and now there's a little jocking

I think about who can be the most

pro-bitcoin politician yes bipartisan

this is a bipartisan issue uh it's

bringing our country together in many

ways which is given what we've just been

through so shocking the one thing that I

will say we need to watch out for is you

know in in China a few years ago it was

blockchain technology all the way we're

going to lead the way and then of course

they banned everything in favor of their

own

um cbdc of course the the the digital

Yuan

um I don't hear talk about that here and

I haven't heard much talk about hey that

this is going to displace the dollar as

the reserve currency of the world that's

very good that we're not hearing that

kind of rhetoric but uh I am sure as the

elections evolve someone will raise it

as an issue nonetheless I think the

momentum is clearly behind Bitcoin now I

I mean

the momentum is clearly behind Bitcoin

a lot of people have anxiety about

regulation uh but and they ask me aren't

you afraid and I have I do not have

anxiety about regulation uh you know

when I look at this I say

yeah

there's a lot of stuff to be worked

through fasbies working through some

accounting issues fdic's working through

some banking issues secs working through

some security issues you know the

administration's working through all

their issues but

regardless of how fast that happens and

how sharp that occurs I don't think

there's any outcome other than favorable

for Bitcoin and I think that what I say

over and over again is Bitcoin is the

ethical

safe haven for any public figure and it

is it is the technical safe haven for

any technical company and it is the

financial safe haven for any investors

so if you have anxiety I think that

people that are thinking about this are

going to realize that Bitcoin is the

risk off crypto asset Network and all of

this regulation is going to create

volatility But ultimately the single

number one most important issue is you

walk into a room with with people that

have collectively 10 or 20 trillion

dollars

and you tell the story and they say well

you know Bitcoin sounds better than gold

and Bitcoin sounds better than owning a

big Tech stock and Bitcoin sounds like

the solution to all the world's problems

and it's just so good that someone is

going to take it away from me

because it's too good

and what you needed is this one page

Memo from the White House saying no

we're not taking it away from you and

then at that point people can start to

put billions of dollars into this asset

sure and I think we have someone at the

SEC

who is behind Bitcoin at MIT certainly

that was the case and uh you know the

SEC has declared as we all know that

Bitcoin is not a security now Gary

Gensler is talking pretty aggressively

about everything else out there being a

security so I think this has elevated

Bitcoin from a a risk point of view not

to to a lower lower risk I shouldn't say

elevated it's it's actually lowered the

risk that it's so clear Bitcoin is not a

security and everything else at least in

chairman gensler's eyes is so the

regulatory future is bright let's talk

about economics look I think

economically everything that's uh that

we're seeing in the last 12 months

inflation

war in Ukraine Russian sanctions the

Canadian trucker crisis

CPI unexpected PPI

and anxiety about uh how to manage a

portfolio all of these things have been

bullish for Bitcoin and anybody that

thinks about it would realize that

although they're unfortunate and

unpleasant for the world

they have underscored to every

mainstream objective Observer the use

case for a global non-sovereign store of

value crypto asset like Bitcoin in a way

that none of Michael Saylor's talking

ever would yes Michael and I had a very

spirited discussion yesterday afternoon

about inflation as an issue or is it

ultimately going to go away and we don't

agree on everything but one thing that I

know and that we agree on is that in if

inflation is an issue clearly Bitcoin is

a great hedge against inflation

when we look at the deflationary impact

of the various technologies that around

which we have centered our research we

think longer term deflation and creative

destruction associated with disruptive

innovation that's the bigger risk and

when you think about Bitcoin in those

terms you're thinking about a hedge

against counterparty risk so if we're

going to have this debt deflationary

bust that some still worry about out

there you've got Bitcoin as a hedge

against that so you know it's as an

investor whenever I hear win win I

usually don't believe it but as it is

very interesting to watch the the equity

markets or the investors in equity

markets treating Bitcoin and other

crypto assets like they are treating the

rest of tech which is not very well of

late

and uh and and to see the holding

behavior in a in the Bitcoin Community I

think uh is it uh 70

of the Bitcoin outstanding so roughly 13

and a half million units of the 19 are

in long-term holding hands so uh more

than six months so the community gets it

and the the my fellow investors will get

it with time but in in the meantime it's

going to be a very nice ride

so I think I mean that's a good segue uh

to technology because I think you're

very enthusiastic about technology I'm

very enthusiastic about technology

and uh I think that technology is is

going to drive adoption of Bitcoin more

aggressively in the coming 36 months

even than it has in the last 36 months

um

I I guess I'd like I'd like to take a

a moment to give a shout out uh to cash

app and to Kraken because I think both

of those companies have done an enormous

service for the Bitcoin Community by

integrating lightning into their

platforms and I think they've thrown

down the gauntlet

you know if I put away my macroeconomic

hat and just think as a technologist

if you're a technical entrepreneur if

you're a venture capitalist and if

you're trying to figure out what's the

next great thing I think it has to

include it has to involve lightning and

somehow and if I look uh if I look at

the industry I think

every crypto exchange if they're going

to remain viable and competitive they

need to build lightning into their

exchange and so I I hope the people that

run exchanges that don't have lightning

are listening to my presentation

um and I and I

you know I think that uh the lesson

that's being uh shown to all of us is if

you want to be successful

then you adopt the Bitcoin standard and

the Bitcoin standard is you buy Bitcoin

you hold Bitcoin you support the Bitcoin

protocol and then you support the layer

two open source permissionless lightning

protocol so that your company can trade

and transact with all of the other

hundreds soon to be thousands soon to be

hundreds of thousands of companies and

this entire asset economy at the speed

of light friction free

Kathy what do you think about technology

Trends are going to impact Bitcoin well

I agree with you on on the lightning

Network I was fascinated we were

studying the announcement this morning

and there's so much friction there has

been so much friction involved in the

process that uh that taking away some of

that friction uh whether it's direct

deposit you can put two percent of your

paycheck into Bitcoin or

um the idea that I don't need I I don't

need to know whether I'm on the

lightning Network or on the base layer I

can I can transact I can become a part

of this community and not have the

friction I think they're pulling a lot

of the difficulty complexity out I've

watched the number of lightning channels

uh they're up to 84 to 90 000. that's

nearly a triple over the last year

that's probably because of El Salvador

with this announcement I think think the

number of channels is and is going to

explode the liquidity we think is going

to go from and I should say we in the

audience we have Yasin almandra and

Frank Downing my secret weapons uh in

terms of Bitcoin and uh everything

crypto for example but we think that the

liquidity which has gone up 10 fold in

dollars fourfold in Bitcoin over the

last year that's just a a taste of

what's going to happen now that cash app

is going to make this make it so much

easier to use the lightning Network and

I also say follow the developers I think

we're going to see an explosion of

developers focused on the lightning

Network and so now I think this has been

the missing link in terms of the the use

case store of value yes it's always been

there means of exchange and unit of

account now have a much better

opportunity

for Bitcoin to to to dominate long term

I

I didn't mention bit pay but I gotta say

I was really excited this week when I

read that bitpay is also supporting

lightning and it made me think

um we're we're re we're in a year right

2022 where people are going to start to

realize that not supporting lightning is

like not supporting the internet

right if you don't support Bitcoin you

don't support sound economics or

Integrity but if you don't support

lightning it's just kind of like cutting

yourself off from the internet and it's

so so much so that you start to think

that I don't want to do business with a

company that doesn't get on board with

lightning like I gotta find another

vendor

and uh I you know I'll tell you another

exciting thing about lightning I I'm I'm

really excited about the speed and uh

transaction velocity I'm excited about

the interoperability everywhere in the

world I'm also excited about uh what

lightning Labs announced this week with

their tarot protocol because if we can

move uh USD stable coins at the speed of

light over the lightning Network

then I think the killer application

the killer application in the world is

going to be when six billion people

maybe eight billion people when your

three-year-olds got when eight billion

people run around with a mobile phone

with an Android or iOS app and they've

got a lightning wallet and that wallet

has got some BTC in it as a store of

value and it's got some USD or Euro or

CNY or whatever as a medium of Exchange

and then you're going to see tens of

trillions and then hundreds of trillions

of dollars all moving on Lightning rails

secured by the Bitcoin Network and then

people are going to wake up and realize

holy crap this stuff really is going to

change the world

[Music]

[Applause]

so impress upon investors how important

this movement is what I usually say is

okay listen to this and listen to every

word because every word is important

Bitcoin is the first

first

global that's really important as

Michael said

private now it's open source but there's

no government involvement so private so

first Global private digital

rules-based monetary system in the

history of the world it is a very big

idea

any form of money moving at any

frequency instantly anywhere in the

world

over Bitcoin right it's such a beautiful

vision

so um let's talk about Capital markets

uh I just think uh We've made enormous

progress 18 months ago microstrategy

bought 250 million dollars of Bitcoin

people thought we were crazy

you know and everybody said well you

bought it you're not gonna you're not

gonna buy any more and when are you

going to sell it

you know and then uh it it uh promptly

traded down and we were down 50 million

dollars and people were dancing on My

Grave gleefully

gleefully speculated about one of the

board of directors was going to fire me

and and then we finish at Dutch auction

and we bought 175 million more and I

thought well I got a 20 cheaper why

wouldn't I

and then people thought well you're

going to stop and then we didn't stop

and then uh Square now block bought

Bitcoin and then Tesla bought Bitcoin

and we bought more Bitcoin we're up to 6

billion Bitcoin

by the way if you want

if you want to turn 250 million into 6

billion

buy Bitcoin

don't buy gold

if I buckled I would have had 250

million dollars worth of gold instead of

six billion dollars worth of bitcoin

so when I say it's a lever and it's a

ladder

I mean yes it's a ladder so

now at the end of right about now we've

got 24 publicly traded minors we gotta

we got another dozen public companies

we've got 100 billion dollars worth of

assets flowing in this economy

investment banks are doing deals they're

doing ATMs they're doing convertible

debt we've done junk bonds we've done

all sorts of things and I feel like the

capital markets coming alive from my

perspective Kathy 24 months ago I went

to Merrill Lynch and I said I want to

buy Bitcoin they laughed at me and said

not only will I not sell it to you we're

not allowed to talk about it or we get

fired

like okay well then I wired like 175

million dollars out of that bank and I

went somewhere else

and you know what's good I think the

Victory lap here is now my inbox has

Bitcoin research from Merrill Lynch sent

to me by the same broker like we're

covering it now

this is what we think

so every bulge bracket firm is starting

to cover it they're also they're all

grudging that they're going to start to

trade it it's coming uh and you've got

all these publicly traded companies that

are leading the way I'm interested in

your perspective as an investor how do

you see the capital markets and and

their attitude toward Bitcoin today

versus year two years ago well it's

improved but

um it's a long way from you know being

fully accepted embraced and so forth

what we're seeing with Bitcoin and

traditional institutional investors is

the same thing Arc is seeing about all

of our strategies associated with all of

our strategies they're very volatile

that's scary for institutional investors

there's no index they're not in my index

so you know this would be very risky to

get involved this is a new asset class

you know and it ha and we don't even

know what the regulations are so we're

seeing a lot of pushbacks still that way

but as many of you may know in our big

Ideas 2022 which is at arc-invest.com we

have a price Target in 2030 for Bitcoin

of more than a million dollars per

Bitcoin and

and yeah see even you can't believe it I

expected a big roaring no but we and if

you go in and you'll see how we build

that case we see institutional investors

all we expect over the next eight years

is

um that two and a half percent roughly

two and a half percent of uh of assets

institutional assets are allocated to

bitcoin so we don't need a lot and if

it's more than that and that's how

institutional investors work they tiptoe

in in the 70s it was real estate in the

80s it was Emerging Markets 80s and 90s

and now I think it's going to be crypto

starting with Bitcoin and that's very

important starting with Bitcoin because

uh they understand what it is and what

it's not it's not a Securities nice

so we gotta wrap it up here

we gotta wrap it up here but I leave you

with two thoughts one uh whenever I meet

with uh very powerful people politicians

Senators Congress uh persons Governors

or whenever I meet with uh billionaires

or CEOs

what normally what they say to me is

my daughter or my son said you're a rock

star and I have to meet you

okay

and they're like yeah

I I you know I I had a guy come to my

house uh that I met his son and the next

day the son brought his father and his

father could like

buy the entire city of Miami and uh and

he said well I don't I don't know what's

going on but I know Bitcoin is really

important and my son says I got to sit

down and listen and so I orange pilled

him for two hours

and uh I'm not gonna say who because

it's such a common story but I but my

point here is every one of you knows

someone go tell a CEO go tell your

father go tell your mother go tell

somebody that Bitcoin is going to change

the world and they should figure out

more about it because the number one

thing you can do is educate the world on

bitcoin and let people know they need to

figure out Bitcoin and every one of you

does make a difference because I would

never get those meetings if it wasn't

like some someone that went and said you

got to pay attention and my last point

to you

you do not sell your Bitcoin

thank you

thank you do not sell your Bitcoin you

just heard it from the Giga Chad CEO

Michael Saylor of microstrategy welcome

back to the marathon desk here loud to

my Bitcoin magazine live at the Bitcoin

conference I'm Natalie Brunel I'm joined

by an amazing panel here on the anchor

desk I've traded mainstream news for

bitcoin news right we've got Dave

Portnoy from barcel Sports Ben askren

also known as Funky Boy right former UFC

fighter and Alex McShane of Bitcoin

magazine what an amazing conversation a

lot of talk about lightning Network

Bitcoin has a powerful savings

technology Dave I'll start with you

because you know what they also talked

about how 15 million coins are in strong

hands Diamond hands and you say you're

Diamond hands so what are your thoughts

yeah I'm never getting rid of mine I've

already sold them like I said once

before I bought at 11 000

um and then the Winkle boss is I guess

you guys say orange bill tried to orange

pill me and they did the reverse they

got me to sell it now now I'm holding on

forever I'll probably die with them just

to prove a point I thought it was Marty

bent that okay Marty bent tried to and

he made no sense as well

very complicated at the time like I

needed like a 3 000 digit code he gave

me a little thing to look like a

keychain he's like it's great but if you

lose it you lose everything

um so he did not orange pill me he

actually scared me away he got me to buy

it and I still do own it I just don't

know where it is this is a great this is

a great Point bringing it back to uh

sailor talking about people

giving other people their introduction

it takes a couple touch points to get it

because it's complicated stuff not

simple starting out in the Bitcoin but

worthwhile if you learn how to buy and

hold right when did it change from

needing like that key so you could just

buy and sell like a normal human you can

always do that obviously it's way like

when I started 2017 it's easier now but

holding it on an exchange or something

is is still kind of risky obviously so

what they were is it uh I mean I guess

there's been no has there been a major

centralized exchange hack not for a long

time like 2016 2017 it was all the time

I think the risk is not none you know

not your keys not your coins so one of

the things they're talking about is this

uh

yeah so the idea is if you don't have it

at your house then someone could take it

from you if it's not exchange they shut

down your access you can't access it

from The Exchange right if you have it

on your trayser or Ledger at home yeah

but if you lose that no one can take you

got your seed words right please tell me

don't have your keywords on your phone

have you not been educated on Cold

versus hot storage do you have your seed

words on your phone no no no but I the

my current I don't want to talk about my

Bitcoins now because

they're not in my house

uh you guys are laughing I'm not

laughing like mine are just an exchange

okay so most people think like you don't

want them there because it could be

hacked or they could shut down your

access whereas okay so a mine I have a

multi-cig not at my house but I know

where they are

um no one can ever take those from me

right they're mine if I want to take an

Argentina they're mine wherever I want

to take them their mind if I lose those

things I can just remember my seed words

and I can re-access my wallets gut

reactions how'd you feel about Michael

Taylor today uh it was good I don't want

to say it was normal Michael Saylor but

there was like I don't feel as though

there's any and I've listened to a lot

of micro Sailors so I don't feel like

there's any revolutionary points being

made yeah I feel like he was a little we

got a little Tamer a little more

reserved public facing sailor today not

what we're used to in the podcast but

yeah I mean one of my favorite quotes

from today was If You Don't See support

Bitcoin you don't support sound

economics if you don't support lightning

you don't support the internet because

really that's what this is all about

this is a technology Network maybe it's

in its early stages but it's growing

very very quickly and it's not only a

powerful savings technology but now it's

lightning a payment rail that can

transform and that's helping us bring

Bitcoin from our store of value last

year we probably saw more of the medium

of exchange you know trade of money in

El Salvador and now we're looking at

unit of account expanding on the

lightning Network I really like to get

two quotes it's an ethical safe haven

for any politician we're going to see

more and more bitcoiners I'm sorry

politicians adopting Bitcoin just

because of the single issue voters that

are going to flock to their support yeah

I really like that Kathy Wood also

pointed out that if the U.S wants to

lose it'll be against Bitcoin so

hopefully we're not going to see that

have Dave have you been bullish on you

know sort of U.S lawmakers adopting

Bitcoin you live in you live in two

cities where the Mayors are for Bitcoin

yeah and it certainly galvanized as a

younger audience right so for the mayor

um Suarez has been great in Miami and I

think they realize it is a way to get a

passionate base behind you not going to

lie I mean I'm in the social media

business popular like Bitcoin and that

Community is a good Community to have

behind you

um don't you know anybody who's trying

to get influence and support their cause

yeah but I was going to say if you do

adopt that Community as as Dave learned

don't sell don't sell

sometimes

yes yeah well earlier Dave and I were

talking about that he thinks they're

Traders I think there are a ton of

hodlers in Bitcoin I am a big hodler but

you still think they're I think I think

there's both yeah

I think there's people who maybe say

they hold all the time and maybe don't

who knows all right I just hold you are

watching the marathon dust coastered by

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about what was discussed all here at the

Bitcoin conference don't forget rule

number one educate someone on bitcoin

rule number two you do not sell your

Bitcoin do not smell your Bitcoin

[Music]